Scrapbookpages Blog

July 27, 2015

Gröning Holocaust trial ‘may have been for nothing’

Filed under: Germany, Holocaust — Tags: — furtherglory @ 8:55 am

The title of my blog post today is a quote from the headline on the latest news article about Oskar Groening, the accountant of Auschwitz who has been recently convicted of being an “accessory to murder.”

Oskar Groening still clinging to life after his conviction

Oskar Groening still clinging to life after his conviction

In the photo above, Oskar Groening appears to be pleading with God to deliver him from the hateful Jews who want him to be sentenced to life in prison.

This quote is from the news story:

Oskar Gröning’s conviction has still not been upheld, as appeals from both plaintiffs and defense wait to be heard. Prosecutors fear that the ruling will be left hanging forever, diminishing its historical importance. […]

Former SS officer Oskar Gröning was convicted a week ago, but the legal process is a long way from over. Both the defense and a handful of co-plaintiffs have now appealed the verdict of the Lüneburg court, which saw the “accountant of Auschwitz” sentenced to four years in prison on 300,000 counts of accessory to murder.

The co-plaintiffs, all based in the United States, think the sentence is too short, and have instructed their Berlin-based lawyer Andreas Schulz to appeal to Germany’s Federal Court of Justice (BGH) to change Gröning’s conviction from accessory to murder to actual murder. “The legal consequence of a murder conviction would be a life sentence,” Schulz told “Der Spiegel” news magazine last Thursday.

That appeal has been derided in the media as “nonsense” by various legal commentators. Gröning spent two years at Auschwitz counting and sorting cash taken from the Jews arriving at the camp. He also stood guard on the ramp as the new arrivals were ordered from the trains. Without proof of any specific crimes, jurists said, there is no way that German law can uphold a murder conviction. “During the trial, I didn’t hear a single piece of evidence that could support a murder conviction,” said lawyer Thomas Walther.

In my humble opinion, this story sheds some light on why the Jews were Holocausted in the first place.  It is because the first three rules of the Jewish religion are REVENGE, REVENGE, REVENGE.

Oskar Groening is literally on his death bed, but these survivors who are living the good life in America now, courtesy of the Holocaust, want him to spend the rest of his life in prison. That kind of attitude contributed to the reason that Hitler wanted the Jews out of Germany in the first place.

100 Comments »

  1. Dear Webmaster! Many comments here – especially that of hermie and eah – are only spraying antisemite hatred abusing of the free speech. So You ought to understand the European Countries which consider Holocaust Denial a criminal offense to punish. The first step is the Holocaust Denial pretending that there are no proofs about it, than come expressions hard In hurting aged survivors and, at the end, the diffusion of antisemite tales accusing Jews of parassitism and exploiting countries etc.
    As WWI and WWII – the suicide of Europe – brooke out as a result of too many troublemakers enjoing free speech in circulation governments want to avoid other tragedies.
    In USA You have no right idea what Nazism really had been; instead of useless celebration there is a need for serious historical studies considering the background of European history, geography and demography; subject almost unknown even at the main universities lIke Harward, Yale, etc.
    It is a good new that at Frankfurth University there will a proper professorship; i find that the German researchers do a very serious research work in history.
    You should overthink the opposition to laws punishing Holocaust Denial.

    Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 30, 2015 @ 1:02 am

    • Dear Webmaster! Many comments here – especially that of hermie and eah – are only spraying antisemite hatred abusing of the free speech.s

      Wolf, I have not said anything that could reasonably be called anti-Semitic — please see my comment re this below — here is a link to it. Please cite something I said that you regard as anti-Semitic.

      Disputing accounts of the ‘Holocaust’ does not make one an anti-Semite. But I can tell you this: the practice of so many Jews — apparently you included — of labelling people who dispute the ‘Holocaust’ as anti-Semitic, or saying/implying that questioning the ‘Holocaust’ is an ‘abuse of free speech’, to the point of advocating or laws against ‘Holocaust denial’, contributes to the development of anti-Semitism. Think about it — think about why that might be.

      And stop saying or inferring that I am an anti-Semite. Thanks in advance.

      Comment by eah — July 30, 2015 @ 3:53 am

      • Replying on another of Your comments I answered this question too.

        Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 31, 2015 @ 6:30 am

      • Sorry Wolf, but I don’t believe you did — in any case, I did not recognize it, so please just copy and paste right here something I said that you regard as anti-Semitic. And clearly label it as such. Thanks in advance.

        Comment by eah — August 1, 2015 @ 12:59 pm

        • “But if you really struck one of these fellows so telling a blow that, observed by the audience, he couldn’t help but agree, and if you believed that this had taken you at least one step forward, your amazement was great the next day. The Jew had not the slightest recollection of the day before, he rattled off his same old nonsense as though nothing at all had happened, and, if indignantly challenged, affected amazement; he couldn’t remember a thing, except that he had proved the correctness of his assertions the previous day.”😉

          Comment by hermie — August 1, 2015 @ 9:25 pm

      • So Wolf, I read your comments again, and now think I see your answer: you feel it is anti-Semitic to 1) say that Jews dominate world finance, and 2) express doubt about your story of encountering SS officers — “three of the worst Eichmann Staff members”.

        Well, re 1), I think I could make a good case that Jews really have and do dominate world finance disproportionately, ie considering their relatively small numbers. About you regarding such an observation, as anti-Semitic, I do not have much to say — except perhaps see my comment above about certain practices and attitudes of Jews contributing to the development of anti-Semitism, which is something you may want to think about. BTW, I was quite surprised to see Jews mentioned in an unfavorable light when I read Sir Walter Scott’s novel ‘Ivanhoe’ — you can read about that here: Sir Walter Scott’s Treatment of Jews in Ivanhoe. ‘Ivanhoe’ was first published in 1820.

        Re 2), I could ask: If I say I don’t believe a word Irene Zisblatt says, does that make me an anti-Semite? If I say I don’t believe the 6m figure because the death toll at Auschwitz was reduced from 4m to approx 1m, does that make an anti-Semite?

        Comment by eah — August 2, 2015 @ 9:49 am

        • Wow. Congratulations for your efforts to answer your own question, eah ! I had told you that wolfie wouldn’t answer and that he would just run away. And that’s exactly what he did. Like the good Jew he is.

          You’ll be called an antisemite as long as you don’t swallow and regurgitate the kosher narrative of WW2 and the “Holocaust”, eah. No need to look for an explanation of wolfie’s defamatory attack against you further than that.

          Comment by hermie — August 4, 2015 @ 8:01 am

    • One more thing Wolf: in a previous comment, I asked that despite your views you not advocate for laws against ‘Holocaust denial’. Such laws are a kind of state persecution — a violation of a person’s basic right to free speech and expression (not to mention historical inquiry — ie what did and did not happen). You of all people should know not to do that, since you were yourself a victim of state persecution.

      Your comment above is doubly disappointing for that reason.

      Comment by eah — July 30, 2015 @ 7:19 am

    • Super Inquisitor Murmelstein once again out to ban dissident opinions and even more inconvenient facts. Another of ‘our’ favorite Obscurantist’s attempt to silence incongruent facts he can’t defeat in the field of debate. In the interest of peace and of the deceitful “never again” trick, of course.😉

      Funny to see that “free speech” in today’s world is in fact only intended to prevent anybody from banning Jews to promote and spread their anti-Goyim detrimental ideologies and concepts, but that the borders of “free speech” are always located where Jews are disturbed. Try to forbid some Jews to spread ideas promoting decadency among Gentiles, and you can be certain that you’ll have to face a Tsunami of outraged Jews with their eyes full of tears and their usual cohorts of Gentile useful idiots. But try to ban the expression of inconvenient hard facts about the “Holocaust” or of anything detrimental to the current Jewish hegemony in Europe and America, and you can be sure that the very same ‘defenders’ of “free speech” will support you in your obscurantist crusade.

      Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 7:56 am

      • Many thanks for the appointment as “super inquisitor” but … I feel not to be fit for that task.

        Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 30, 2015 @ 10:18 am

    • How about an answer to my question, Wolf?

      Please cite something I said that you regard as anti-Semitic.

      Comment by eah — July 30, 2015 @ 1:13 pm

      • “How about an answer to my question, Wolf?…….Please cite something I said that you regard as anti-Semitic.”

        I’m afraid you’ll never get any response to that one, eah. Don’t you know how Jews ‘debate’? Never read Mein Kampf?😉

        Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 2:16 pm

    • Wolf?

      Comment by eah — July 30, 2015 @ 11:59 pm

      • Wolfie won’t answer and meet your challenge. Because he can’t. (You know better than anyone else that you’re not an antisemite.)

        But be sure of one thing: Wolfie will call you an antisemite again, again, and again, in order to discredit the inconvient facts and questions you bring on this blog.

        Adolf Hitler – Mein Kampf:

        “The more I argued with them (Jews), the better I came to know their dialectic. First they counted on the stupidity of their adversary, and then, when there was no other way out, they themselves simply played stupid. If all this didn’t help, they pretended not to understand, or, if challenged, they changed the subject in a hurry, quoted platitudes which, if you accepted them, they immediately related to entirely different matters, and then, if again attacked, gave ground and pretended not to know exactly what you were talking about. Whenever you tried to attack one of these apostles, your hand closed on a jelly-like slime which divided up and poured through your fingers, but in the next moment collected again. But if you really struck one of these fellows so telling a blow that, observed by the audience, he couldn’t help but agree, and if you believed that this had taken you at least one step forward, your amazement was great the next day. The Jew had not the slightest recollection of the day before, he rattled off his same old nonsense as though nothing at all had happened, and, if indignantly challenged, affected amazement; he couldn’t remember a thing, except that he had proved the correctness of his assertions the previous day.

        Sometimes I stood there thunderstruck. I didn’t know what to be more amazed at: the agility of their tongues or their virtuosity at lying.”

        So familiar…

        Comment by hermie — July 31, 2015 @ 7:33 am

        • edit: “inconvenient”, not “inconvient”

          Comment by hermie — July 31, 2015 @ 8:16 am

  2. The latest news reports are that American jews (all of whom have profited handsomely from the furtherance of the Holocaust ‘narrative’) are not satisfied with an ‘accessory to murder’ charge any more, and are now appealing the recent conviction and pushing for a full charge of 300,000 counts of murder.

    Can the madness get any worse?

    Comment by Anaxarchus — July 29, 2015 @ 8:54 am

  3. “In my humble opinion, this story sheds some light on why the Jews were Holocausted in the first place. It is because the first three rules of the Jewish religion are REVENGE, REVENGE, REVENGE. […] That kind of attitude contributed to the reason that Hitler wanted the Jews out of Germany in the first place.”

    I’d rather have said PARASITISM, DOMINATION and EXPLOITATION.

    What did the Jews of the 1920’s and 1930’s (who made Hitler want them out) want to revenge for? For being welcomed en masse by the too kind Germans when they were fleeing the Czarist “Pale”?? If so, they should have thanked Hitler, whose “Final Solution” can be summarized as follows “Back to the Pale, Ostjuden !”😉

    IMO, Hitler’s desire for the uprooting of Jewry came from the harmful consequences of “Jewish emancipation”. Jewish emancipation had brought an exponential growth of Jewish power during the second half of the 19th century. The effects of two great Jewish conspiracies (i.e. Zionism and Marxism), of two types of “world-wide conspiracy for the overthrow of civilisation and for the reconstitution of society [in favor of Jewish hegemony]” (as Winston Churchill put it in 1920), could be felt very much in Hitler’s days. And some people had other plans than to become acquiescent slaves of an Almighty Jewry, some people willing to fight to oppose their enslavement and their people’s one. Hitler was of course of those unfortunately-too-few people. Not everybody is a corrupt careerist pig like Churchill and Roosevelt.

    Comment by hermie — July 28, 2015 @ 7:45 am

    • One has to know Moses Hess to understand the Jewish attack on Germany which finally brought a reaction by Hitler.

      Moses (Moshe) Hess (1812-1875) was a Jewish philosopher, a friend and collaborator of Karl Marx, and one of the founders of Labor Zionism. He wrote:

      “The race struggle is the primal one, and the class struggle secondary. The last dominating race is the German. […] Yet it seems that a final race struggle is unavoidable” – Moses Hess, “Rome and Jerusalem: The Last National Question”, 1861.

      When the founder of Political Zionism Theodor Herzl first read “Rome and Jerusalem”, he wrote about Hess that “since Spinoza jewry had no bigger thinker than this forgotten Moses Hess” and that he would not have written his Zionist manifesto “Der Judenstaat” if he had known “Rome and Jerusalem” beforehand. And Zionist leader Vladimir Ze’ev Jabotinsky honored Hess in his Zionist book “The Jewish Legion in World War” as one of those people that made the Balfour declaration possible, together with Herzl, Rothschild and Pinsker.

      Perhaps no one better personifies the axis of leftist thought, Jewish exceptionalism, and a vision of authoritarian imposition of Jewish messianicism than Moses Hess. Hess was a tremendous influence upon Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels. Obsessed with “the race struggle” between ethnic nations for predomination, Hess became a Jewish nationalist socialist bent on the eradication of the “German race” and the imposition of Jewish supremacism.

      Comment by hermie — July 28, 2015 @ 7:55 am

      • Obviously the Jews really messed up when they allowed Hitler to take power. Obviously they thought they could control him with their evil Zionist/Marxist
        Kung foo grip.
        Anti-Semetic nonsense.
        The truth is, German Jews were highly assimilated into German society and often intermarried with Christian Germans. They were highly nationalistic and many Jews fought bravely in World War One. There were Zionist groups in Germany but they often clashed with more conservative Jews.
        There were many Jews that were communists but Jewish Communists often stopped identifying themselves as Jews. Jewish Communists were often driven to Communism because of the widespread discrimination against Jews in Europe and other places in the world. The same way radical Jews turned to Zionism, radical groups often turn to radical solutions when they are disenfranchised. This same thing happened to non-Jews like Ho Chi Minh, Mao Tse Tung and Kim Il Jung and their followers.
        The idea that there is some sort of monolithic Jewish Conspiracy is ridiculous, just as the idea of monolithic communism turned out to be ridiculous. Communist governments separated themselves along national lines. The Soviet Union started out dominating other national Communist parties but this fell apart. The Sino-Soviet split and Yugoslavia are the two biggest examples of this.
        I’d continue with social studies lesson but I’m going back to work.

        Comment by P. O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 9:01 am

        • “Obviously the Jews really messed up when they allowed Hitler to take power. Obviously they thought they could control him with their evil Zionist/Marxist
          Kung foo grip.”

          Don’t forget to edit your post when you copy/paste stuff from your Hasbara manual. Otherwise that makes a weird typo.😉

          And the Zionist Jews didn’t mess up when they allowed Hitler to take power. Zionism has always needed Anti-Semitism like a diabetic needing insulin injections regularly. Deprive a diabetic of his insulin and a Zionist of his Anti-Semitic bogeyman, and both will convulse on the floor within hours.

          The British “Passfield White Paper” of 1930 had been a clear warning to the Zionist land grabbers of that time. And the British “White Paper” of 1939 only demonstrated that their fears were fully entitled. The Zionist clique of the 1930’s and 1940’s needed an Anti-Semitic enemy more than ever. No Hitler, no colonial state of Israel. Guaranteed…

          “The truth is, German Jews were highly assimilated into German society and often intermarried with Christian Germans.”

          And their lot in pre-war Germany showed every Jew of this world that Assimilationism (the great rival of Zionism at that time) was dooomed to fail, a dead end leading nowhere. That’s why foreign Top Zionists like Stephen Wise and Samuel Untermyer attacked Nazi Germany so aggressively from day one. The real aim of those American agitators was not the improvement of German Jewry’s lot as claimed. Their real aim was the worsening of German Jewry’s lot as much as possible, that in order to transfer them en masse to Palestine, what was done. Not hard to see through that. Zionists wanting to see Jews remain where they were, that would have been a great premiere.

          “Jewish Communists were often driven to Communism because of the widespread discrimination against Jews in Europe and other places in the world. ”

          That’s why Churchill decided to become a Zionist agent, in order to prevent England’s Jewry from becoming what Herzl called a “Jewish revolutionary proletariat” (what would have endangered his Duke’s tender ass). That and his own materialistic interests of course.

          “The idea that there is some sort of monolithic Jewish Conspiracy is ridiculous”

          That’s what most Russian aristocrats used to think…until they were shot into pits by the victorious Bolshevik Jews and their puppets.

          ” just as the idea of monolithic communism turned out to be ridiculous”

          Communist didn’t turn out to be ridiculous. It turned out to be useless for Jewry and so liquidated. Funny to know that Ben-Gurion had ‘prophesized’ in the 1960’s that the fall of Communist Russia would take place in the late 1980’s. Another amazing coincidence, I guess.

          “I’d continue with social studies lesson but I’m going back to work.”

          But you’re working, Hasbara Hero. You’re working for the continuation of the right to occupy others’ land. Not a small task…

          Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 8:38 am

          • That was not a typo. I came up with that myself. I’m clever that way.
            I have no idea what you mean by Hasbara. You need to explain this so I have context.
            It’s fascinating to see your train of thought. So, in the interest of regaining Isreal the world Jewish population was willing to sacrifice the Jews of Europe. I see.
            Oh, and Communists were nothing but Jewish puppets. Ok.
            And Churchill was a Zionist agent.
            All right.
            And you accuse Wolf of being a paranoid wacko.

            Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 10:14 am

            • “I have no idea what you mean by Hasbara.”

              So smart trick, chosen genius. But I feel that you know very well what I’m talking about.

              Or had you really ignored the meaning of “Hasbara”, you could just have googled it. But that would have deprived us of your funny fakely-naive “I don’t know what you’re talinkg about” game. I wouldn’t have wanted to miss that.😉

              “So, in the interest of regaining Isreal the world Jewish population was willing to sacrifice the Jews of Europe. I see.”

              Sacrifice? Only a Holocaust believer would believe that. No. The Zionists only wanted that others tickle them a little in order to make them pack up their bags and go to Palestine. Even if the Zionist leaders of that time didn’t care at all about the death of some of them in the process. Indeed. One of them (was that Ben-Gurion or Weizmann?) even saif that a cow in Palestine was more valuable to him than a thousand Jews in Europe.

              “Communists were nothing but Jewish puppets.”

              The Jewish essence of Communism and its leadership has been recognized by many knowledgeable men, including 1st-class Jew lovers like Churchill.

              “And Churchill was a Zionist agent.”

              By his own admission, yes. He became one (call him a “Zionist sympathizer” if you prefer that) at Manchester, where he met Weizmann (who was University lecturer there at that time), around 1909. Churchill was one of the few non-Jewish politicians in Britain (with Lloyd-George) the oppose the anti-Zionist Passfield & MacDonald “White Papers” upon their very issuance and to condemn publicly his countries’ Palestine policy. And in the 1930’s and 1940’s, Churchill was sponsored by the “Focus Group” (headed by Israel’s founding father Sir Robert Waley-Cohen).

              “And you accuse Wolf of being a paranoid wacko.”

              No. Even worse. I accuse – J’accuse😉 – his entire race of being nothing but a gang of consanguineous wackos. But are you sure that you want to go into that topic (i.e. the prevalence of mental disorders within the consanguineous progeny of Europe’s Ghetto scum)?

              Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 2:18 pm

              • No, I don’t want to google it. I want you to explain it to me.
                So, please, explain it to me. I want YOUR definition. I honestly don’t know, I’ve never heard the term before.

                Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 2:40 pm

                • I know you know. But as you insist, let’s play…

                  My definition of “Hasbara” is: an army of publicists/propagandists paid by the state of Israel to spread pro-Zionist misinformation and fight against information detrimental to the reputation of Israel and Zionism in general on the internet through various debating techniques (often dishonest; they are instructed about that). Or in other words, Professional Zio-Cyber-Warriors.

                  Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 4:08 pm

                • Sigh.
                  I have a regular job. No on pays me to promote anything. I majored in history at school and it remains something of a passion with me it just doesn’t pay the bills. I enjoy European history in general and WW2 in particular. As the Holocast is a fact of WW2 I’ve read extensively about it. I stumbled upon this blog by accident one night. I don’t particularly agree with the author of this blog however I’m impressed by his extensive research and he is obviously well traveled.
                  I know you won’t believe the fact that I’m not employed by Isreal because that does not fit your world view. I question whether or not you’ve actually ever met a Jew or that you would recognize a Jew even if you did meet one. I myself am not Jewish, I’m Roman Catholic like your hero Adolph Hitler. You can believe me or not, I don’t care.

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 5:24 pm

            • I didn’t ask for your biography, P.O. Truth. No Hasbara cyber-fighter would ever admit that he’s one. So your unrequested bio (maybe true, maybe not; I don’t know and I don’t care) is useless anyway.

              Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 8:04 am

              • So, I answer you regarding this absurd charge that I’m employed by the state of Isreal and it holds no weight with you.
                It’s interesting to see how the Denier mind works. First, they say that something is a lie or a delusion. So you provide an answer or evidence. They say it is made up, the witness is deranged or lying. Then you show them photos or provide reports supporting history and they say the people that wrote the report are in the pay of Isreal, there’s no way to know when the photos were taken etc. etc. But, they expect you to take the word of discredited pseudo historians or quacks. If you don’t then you are either a collaborator of the state of Isreal or a Jew.
                I’m sorry, I prefer to read books and articles written by real historians like Ian Kershaw, Richard J. Evans, Andrew Roberts than old frauds like Faurrison.

                Comment by P. O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 10:27 am

                • Don’t play idiots, P.O. You didn’t really believe that your words alone (words that I can’t check by any means) would have any probative weight concerning your real status, did you? Is that the level of Holocaust believers’ evidential standards? Quite telling…

                  You know your words alone prove nothing. Didn’t you write “You can believe me or not” in your bio?

                  Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 2:26 pm

                • No, I think that you not believing me is expected. That’s to be expected from someone who believes that life is one big conspiracy theory.

                  Comment by HCW — July 30, 2015 @ 2:41 pm

                • “That’s to be expected from someone who believes that life is one big conspiracy theory.”

                  Ironically, that’s the orthodox narratives of WW2 and the ‘Holocaust” which were labelled a conspiracy [theory] at Nuremberg. Never heard of the ‘Nazi conspirators’ planning wars of conquest for years and of the ‘Nazi conspiracy’ to murder all the Jews of Europe, P.O. HCW? All Nuremberg vocabulary and fables.

                  It seems that the conspiracy theorist here is not the one expected at first after all…😉

                  Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 3:16 pm

                • Actually the idea that the Nazis, or more correctly, Adolph Hitler, had some sort of concrete plan for the conquest of Europe and the destruction of Europe’s Jews is a case of reading history backwards. Except for some vague views about reuniting Germans and Eastern expansion, plus the expulsion of the Jews from Germany a lot of what Hitler did had the look of improvisation. The Anschlus with Austria was a desired outcome but the manner it came about was very improvised with Herman Goering being the driving force. Hitler showed no personal animosity towards the Poles, as an Austrian he disliked Czechs more. I think had the Poles accepted the return of the corridor to Germany and an alliance with Germany Hitler would have compensated the Poles with lands in the Western Soviet Union. It was only after the Poles rejected this did Hitler turn against them.
                  Some aspects of the Holocaust were planned in regards to Soviet POWs and Communist political officials but the killings of Jews were very haphazard, starting with the Einzattsgruppen killings after the invasion of the Soviet Union. The Nazis then moved to gas vans and then fixed gas chambers.
                  So, I think the idea there was some type of master plan was wrong.

                  Comment by P.O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 6:44 pm

                • Dear P.O.Truth! Already about 1875 Professor Paul Boettiler/Paul de la Guarde pubbished the idea of Germany conquering Poland in order to settle there German Farmers – who so could avoid emigration to USA – and the Jews from Poland settled or in Palestine or at Madagascar. In other writing Paul de la Guarde theorized an German ruled European Area from the Nord Sea to the Adria, from the Baltic Sea to the Black Sea and from the Marne to the Memel, including so Poland. In the thirties, while having a good relationship with the Polish Colonells, Nazi Germany launched many research project on economy and demographie of Poland collecting many data turned out as usefull when enslavering the Poles and starting the destruction of Jewish comunities. Maybe there was not masterplan but a masteridea existed. Good bye.

                  Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 31, 2015 @ 3:08 am

                • I share your opinion that there was no master plan but rather a series of improvisations.

                  Hitler had dropped the idea of getting the Korridor back (if a peaceful and fair agreement with Poland could be reached). He even offered to guarantee the Versailles borders of Poland in exchange of the return of Danzig and a road (railway/autobahn) through the Korridor connecting Eastern Prussia with the rest of the Reich. Very minimal demands. He couldn’t ask less than that. Hitler was critized by some people in Germany for asking so little, for conceding so much to Poland. And Hitler’s demands didn’t even damage Poland’s interests. Poland had built her own port city (Gdynia) in the 1920’s & 1930’s (and so didn’t really needed Danzig anymore), and Hitler was even willing to preserve Poland’s commercial prerogatives at Danzig after the return of that city.

                  But the British military agreement torpedoed the Germano-Polish negotiations. Abrupt cessation. With the military support of the greatest empire on earth, the military junta ruling over Poland at that time had no good reasons to talk to its German neighbor for a peaceful and fair settlement of their disputes, but very good reasons to hope territorial gains at the expense of Germany after a quite easy & short war crushing Germany under the combined might of the Polish, French and British armies.

                  Comment by hermie — July 31, 2015 @ 6:53 am

                • To Wolf:
                  Thank you for the information. I’m currently reading Hitler’s Empire by Mark Mazower which includes a lot of the information you provided. I was writing about how Hitler looked at Poland.
                  And Hermie, I can buy that the Poles stopped negotiating when they received the backing of the French and British. Subsequent events show that the Poles miscalculated how much the West would back them. And your idea that the Poles and the West were going to crush Germany between their armies is not born out by what happened. The French made a half-assed attempt to invade Germany but pulled back without encountering German forces. This happened at a time when Germany was extremely vulnerable on the Western front. Hitler expected the French and British to bail on the Poles and they did, he just didn’t expect them to declare war. As for partisans, the people in Western Soviet Union did welcome the Germans as liberators. It was only after the Germans started stealing everything in sight, snatching people for labor and allowing Soviet POWs to starve to death did resistance become a problem.
                  I’m now abandoning this thread. I read this on my phone and the text has now stretched beyond all recognition. I’m having a hard time reading replies so if you want to continue this discussion take it to another subject.

                  Comment by HCW — August 1, 2015 @ 9:34 am

                • “Subsequent events show that the Poles miscalculated how much the West would back them.”

                  The British military agreement was a real “blank check” indeed. The British leaders of that time didn’t care at all about Poland. Poland only provided them with a great excuse for a war on Germany.

                  “And your idea that the Poles and the West were going to crush Germany between their armies is not born out by what happened. The French made a half-assed attempt to invade Germany but pulled back without encountering German forces.”

                  The French army of that time was one the most powerful armies in the world, but it was very poorly led. Old French generals fighting like in the 19th century couldn’t compete with the modern and innovative German warfare of the 3rd Reich. And the French were the less enthusiastic members of the French-British-Polish coalition. Most of them were just fed up with a new world war. The previous one had left them exhausted and disgusted.

                  “As for partisans, the people in Western Soviet Union did welcome the Germans as liberators. It was only after the Germans started stealing everything in sight, snatching people for labor and allowing Soviet POWs to starve to death did resistance become a problem.”

                  The eternal problem of any playgrounds in the world. “He gave the 1st hit, Sir. – No, he’s lying. HE hit me first.”

                  You say that German actions brought the partisan warfare while I say that the partisan warfare brought German countermeasures which made the German forces in Soviet countries become unpopular there.

                  An Insoluble question, I guess…

                  Comment by hermie — August 1, 2015 @ 9:16 pm

  4. Again, not sure I really see the point in sending a man in his 90’s to prison. We should be encouraging him to tell what happened so this is part of the historical record, not wasting time convicting him. I really don’t see the point in wasting tax payer money in an instance where he is not going to spend a day a jail.
    As for his sentence, 4 years is life.

    Comment by P. O. Truth — July 27, 2015 @ 2:42 pm

  5. Dear Furtherglory! Jewish religios call for justice of G’D and not for revenge as You and Your friends are told by Christian pastors and priests.
    I am one of many Holocaust survivors who do not live a good life nor in USA or elsewhere. In my opinion justice ought to make clear what happened at those times of darkness and the deeds of who stood guard at the ramp and had to count and sort the cash and belongings of the victims and whether that had been accessory to murder or proper murder. A question important for history.
    I myself add that the SS had been an armed Party Militia and, legally speacking, not a regular military unit. So, for a long time no one had been compelled to enlist in the SS. I would ask Herr Groening when and why he did enlist in the SS.
    As above comment of “eah” states Herr Groening will never spend time in prison.

    Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 27, 2015 @ 10:23 am

    • I would ask Herr Groening when and why he did enlist in the SS.

      Why is that important? How is it relevant?

      As a matter of fact — I know you are not that interested in facts — the SS was a prestigious and selective organization in Nazi Germany. It’s completely understandable that an ambitious young person at the time might want to join. It’s also understandable that someone interested in joining the SS would be ignorant of most things the organization was (also allegedly) involved in. It was only after the war that the victorious Allies 1) declared the SS a de jure “criminal organization”, and 2) treated every member as in some way a criminal, regardless of what they had or had not done.

      Get a grip.

      Comment by eah — July 27, 2015 @ 11:32 am

      • I am more interested in facts then You are. Until a certain moment enlisting in the SS was matter of personal choice when fullfiling all racial and ideological requirements. Then state officials, professors, etc, had been bestoved with an SS rank. In last war years a certain part of recruits – 20% – had to be enlisted in compulsary way. So this question is important, at least for history. As explained by the daughter of Rudolf Hoess – Auschwitz Commander – once one had been in the SS he could not avoid to be accomplice of various crimes. Nevertheless there had been some “Guter Kerl” – good guy – who even helped prisioniers or had not been so bad.

        Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 27, 2015 @ 12:03 pm

        • …once one had been in the SS he could not avoid to be accomplice of various crimes.

          So I guess since she said it, it must be true, and true for every member of the SS.

          What nonsense. Honestly Wolf — before I tried to always be respectful toward you, because I know you and your family suffered at the hands of the Nazis, as so many did. But really — you are sometimes just too much.

          Comment by eah — July 27, 2015 @ 12:11 pm

          • Herr “eah”! The SS had been the “army formed by simple men called to enforce the obeyance to the master chied” as theorized centuries before. The SS had to obey to the nazi racist doctrine and to what had been presented as the will of the Fuehrer. I am studying the history of WWII and Holocaust since I had been 9 years old. Models for the SS had been the German Knights Order and the Temple Order but within German Christianity with Faith only in Germany. Not only Germany but also other countries are responsable for events occured. In Germany old German myths, in Hungary old hungarian stories, in Rumenia the belief in an Arcangel, etc. brought to nazi-fascism and antisemite hatred. Good bye for today; further facts will follow. Wolf.

            Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 27, 2015 @ 2:00 pm

        • Oscar Groening did in fact volunteer for the SS. He also protested the execution of Jews, not because of the fact they were murdered but because the way the children were murdered. He attempted to leave his post at Auschwitz by applying for military service at the front but his superiors denied him the transfer.
          What I find amusing (and I admit the older I get the more I find amusing) is that I see Holocaust Deniers jumping to Groening’s defense even though he has repeatedly stated the Jews were murdered in gas chambers and that he does not understand why Deniers state there were no gas chambers. Irony really is bitch.

          Comment by P. O. Truth — July 27, 2015 @ 3:00 pm

          • repeatedly stated the Jews were murdered in gas chambers

            Hinweis: It is against the law in Germany to deny Jews were killed in gas chambers. That’s called Holocaustverleugnung. You can and will go to jail for doing that. No defense is possible. There are many people jailed not only in Germany, but in other countries as well, for this ‘crime’.

            Zweiter Hinweis: Oskar Groening is in Germany, where he is being tried as an accessory to murder.

            Question: Do you really expect anyone who knows that to take seriously the tales told by a very old man who is probably just doing his best to stay out of jail, so he can live out his final years in peace? Is it really a surprise that he would tell the court what it wanted to hear? That he would choose not to judicially complicate his life further by inviting the additional charge of being a Holocaustleugner?

            What an ass you are.

            Comment by eah — July 28, 2015 @ 10:29 am

            • Wow, I’ve gone from being a jerk to an ass.
              I admit I am impressed by you using German words to correct me.
              You do make a valid point. However I’m going to remind you that Groening himself has spoken out against Holocaust Denial long before he had any legal issues. He once took a Denial pamphlet, wrote rebuttals and sent it back to the author. He allowed the BBC to interview him regarding his time in Auschwitz. He volunteered to do this and was not coerced into doing so my original point still stands: it’s ironic that Holocaust Deniers are coming out the woodwork to defend a man who repeatedly stated that Jews died in gas chambers in Birkenau.

              Comment by P. O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 11:33 am

              • You do make a valid point.

                Try making one yourself for a change.

                to defend a man

                I have never said one word in defense of Gröning. Why would I? I am neutral about him, mostly due to his age. Before in a comment here I said something like it was pathetic (look it up) the way he prattled on in court about gas chambers etc, while admitting he’d never seen an actual gas chamber in operation himself.

                Comment by eah — July 28, 2015 @ 11:47 am

                • You seem especially testy with me lately. Is it something I said? As for points, I believe I have made a great many points. I also generally back it up with the books I’ve read. I even supplied you with a link for pictures after you requested it. When asked I’ve provided the relevant information. I also fully admit that the allies in WW2 committed atrocities. What else do you require?

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 11:55 am

            • “Is it really a surprise that he would tell the court what it wanted to hear? That he would choose not to judicially complicate his life further by inviting the additional charge of being a Holocaustleugner?”

              As P.O. Arrogant Liar said, Gröning said similar things years ago. His alleged trial came for the 10th anniversary of his anti-denial acting performance in a BBC TV documentary. That’s why I had said at the very beginning of his ‘trial’ (on this blog) that the whole thing was just a show and that Gröning would never see the interior of a prison cell…what is happening exactly as I had said several months ago. Gröning is patently (and he has been for at least a decade now) a collaborator, an employee, of Zionist Jewry and the pro-Zionist vassal state of Germany. Bad theater. Pathetic show…

              Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 8:54 am

              • I don’t lie. Why would I lie?
                Deniers make points. I refute them facts. How is this lying? I’m willing to paste links, give a reading list, etc.
                Please feel free to fact check anything I’ve ever said. The sarcasm and name calling didn’t start with me. I feel it necessary to come to Wolf’s defense on occasion because I think he struggles with a language barrier.

                Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 10:19 am

                • And Groening is a collaborator because he spoke about his time at Auschwitz? A past he is now facing jail time for? Is he a collaborator for what he witnessed, or because what he said doesn’t conform to your world view?

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 10:23 am

                • “Deniers make points. I refute them facts. How is this lying?”

                  OK. Not a liar, a smuggler of Holo-lies. Happy now?😉

                  “to come to Wolf’s defense on occasion because I think he struggles with a language barrier.”

                  Me too. So what? Will you come to my defense (Defense?!? Is this a fight? A fight for what?) too, Moshe?

                  ” A past he is now facing jail time for? ”

                  Pleaaase. You know as well as I do that Gröning doesn’t face jail and (but you won’t admit it) that he never did. Don’t make me drink pee and tell me it’s apple juice. I can recognize bad theater when I see some. Don’t insult my intellect…

                  Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 2:36 pm

                • I have also said that I don’t think Groening will face jail time. I have also said that I opposed him going to trial in the first place. I’ve even said I oppose Holocaust Denial laws because I am in favor of free speech. And as for giving Holocast lies…..why is it a lie if it is something you don’t believe in? The Holocast is a fact of history. Not believing in it isn’t going to make it go away.

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 2:47 pm

                • I will come to your defense in this way. I believe that everyone has the right to think and say what they believe in as long as they don’t advocate violence. That is an idea that Americans have bled for.

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 2:50 pm

                • “The Holocast is a fact of history.”

                  History is written by…bla bla bla (You know the rest.)

                  History can drape in clothes of science. It is just state-sponsored partial storytelling. The Holohoax has demolished the pretensions of history to be a real science forever…

                  “Not believing in it isn’t going to make it go away.”

                  I know that. Do you mistake me with a scared child who has just seen a monster in his closet?

                  Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 4:24 pm

      • You are right in saying that the allies made the SS a criminal organization. You are wrong in stating each individual was considered a criminal. The tribunal left individual guilt up to the prosecuting body because they recognized that not every member of the SS committed crimes.

        Comment by P. O. Truth — July 27, 2015 @ 2:50 pm

        • One of my very first blog posts was entitled “SS soldiers have an undeserved bad reputation:
          https://furtherglory.wordpress.com/2010/05/25/ss-soldiers-have-an-undeserved-bad-reputation/

          This quote is from that blog post:

          “At the Nuremberg International Military Tribunal, SS Lt. General Ernst Kaltenbrunner testified that there were 13 Stammlager (main concentration camps) in the Nazi camp system. One of these camps was Matzgau, located near Danzig; it was a camp where SS guards were imprisoned for offenses such as physical mistreatment of concentration camp prisoners, embezzlement, or theft. Yet tour guides at Dachau routinely tell visitors that the guards could do anything they wanted to with regard to abusing or killing the prisoners.”

          When Dachau was liberated, there were 128 SS soldiers in the Dachau prison. They were let out and given the job of keeping order during the liberation. Some of the soldiers were killed by the American liberators, simply because they were SS soldiers.

          Comment by furtherglory — July 28, 2015 @ 6:54 am

          • There numerous stories of SS men behaving decently, even kindly, to Poles and Jews. The men who joined the SS did so out of many different reasons.

            Comment by P. O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 10:07 am

    • You seemingly shitted your pants like somebody in the final phase of cholera every time you saw SS guys, didn’t you wolfie?

      Will you tell us your funny story of ‘evil SS guys’ standing just in front of you – what amounted to a real “Holocaust” according to you – once again?😉

      Comment by hermie — July 28, 2015 @ 8:09 am

      • Herr Hermie! I myself stood about four or five times in face of SS officiers. At April 9, 1945 I had to be taken to the Kommandatur/Headquarter of Terezin and after waiting for hours I had been questioned by three of the worst Eichmann Staff members – Alois Brunner, Hans Guenther, Ernst Moes – and risked to become a hostage. My Father – being the Elder of Jews in Terezin – had to face the Commander every day at morning and some days even in other times too. Every time could be the last one.
        Expessions like “shitted your pants” are tipical rude SS language; You are very illmanered.
        This is a fact I remember well although I had asked my Father to avoid to mention it in his book TEREZIN – EICHMANN’S SHOW GHETTO.
        I would like to see You and some other commentator of this site to stay, just for an hour, in face of an armed person showing to hate You and has the power to order to kill You. Would be very amusand, I think that after such a test You will better understand events and avoid nazi speeches.

        Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 28, 2015 @ 9:54 am

        • I think that is a very good point. I’d like to see Hermie’s reaction to something like this. Could you remain composed in front of armed men? Better yet, could you remain composed as a child?

          Comment by P. O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 10:02 am

          • Whether Wolf ever faced intimidating SS men is not relevant to anything discussed on this site. Certainly not to whether or not the ‘Holocaust’ did, or could have, taken place as commonly claimed.

            Comment by eah — July 28, 2015 @ 10:37 am

            • Herr “eah”! My deportation to Terezin – antichamber of Auschwitz-Birlenau – occured inside the nazi Holocaust actions; our survival had not been wanted. I feel You regret it. Terezin had been the Model Ghetto set up to deceive Red Cross and other foreign visitors. Clear?

              Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 28, 2015 @ 11:27 am

            • Hermie asked him to tell the story making it a relevant point of discussion on this website.

              Comment by P. O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 11:35 am

              • “Hermie asked him to tell the story making it a relevant point of discussion on this website.”

                Not really. I sarcastically wondered if he would do that again. And that’s what he did. Like the ridiculous clown he is.😉

                Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 9:03 am

          • Take a drunk SS man shouting nazi slogans against British and USA plutocracies.

            Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 31, 2015 @ 9:16 am

        • “At April 9, 1945 I had to be taken to the Kommandatur/Headquarter of Terezin and after waiting for hours I had been questioned by three of the worst Eichmann Staff members – Alois Brunner, Hans Guenther, Ernst Moes”

          I wonder what kind of information 3 prominent staff members of Eichmann’s cabinet hoped to get from a 9-year-old boy? The name of your favorite candies?

          ” Every time could be the last one.”

          …but, by some miracle (another one !), never was.😉

          Pure fantasy.

          What a race of paranoid wackos ! Amazing !!

          Comment by hermie — July 28, 2015 @ 5:29 pm

          • You’re accusing him of being a paranoid wacko??????? Mr., the Jews control everything, the Zionists are out to get us????????????? Yeah. That makes sense.
            He lived during that time, you didn’t.

            Comment by P.O. Truth — July 28, 2015 @ 8:26 pm

            • “You’re accusing him of being a paranoid wacko??????? ”

              It seems that I’ve made you go crazy with that one. Haven’t I, Hasbara hero?

              “the Jews control everything”

              I didn’t say the Jews control everything. ‘Only’ politics, economics, academia, and media. For the sun and the wind, I need to investigate a little further.😉

              Any person testing Voltaire’s famous quote (the one about the people nobody is allowed to criticize) on today’s Jews can see a blatant demonstration of that sad truth.

              “the Zionists are out to get us?????????????”

              Not to get us. To promote the growth and the continuation of their beloved land grabbing colonial state in Palestine.

              “He lived during that time, you didn’t.”

              And I didn’t live in the Middle Age either, but I know a few things about that era nevertheless. Medieval chroniclers (the reporters of that time) often wrote bullshits glorifying their employer (a kind or a lord) even if they lived at that time. The argument of contemporaneity, so often used by Holohoax propagandists, is a complete fallacy.

              Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 7:59 am

              • I find the fact that you called someone a paranoid wacko highly amusing.
                I do apologize for exaggerating what you’ve said in the past. You’re right, you’ve never claimed that the Jews control everything. Obviously they don’t control the weather.
                Or, do they??????? I’m sure some whacked out Holocaust Denier somewhere can conclusively prove that the Jews in fact control the weather and were behind the assassination of JFK.

                Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 10:32 am

                • “I find the fact that you called someone a paranoid wacko highly amusing.”

                  Even Goyim are amusing and funny now !?! The world is really going crazy, doesn’t it?

                  “I do apologize for exaggerating what you’ve said in the past. You’re right, you’ve never claimed that the Jews control everything. Obviously they don’t control the weather.”

                  I find that it rains very often where I’m living. I suspect a Jewish conspiracy behind that. I must investigate deeper into that one.

                  (I’m of course joking.)

                  Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 3:36 pm

            • Uhh, can you perhaps admit that Wolf’s story is rather implausible?

              I wonder what kind of information 3 prominent staff members of Eichmann’s cabinet hoped to get from a 9-year-old boy?

              For more implausibility, search out and watch Irene Zisblatt relating what she says happened to her at Auschwitz — you need your head examined if you believe a word of it.

              For the record, I am similarly skeptical of Wolf’s claim. Or perhaps you can answer the question above?

              Noch ein Hinweis: Sorry, but MANY of the supposed ‘eyewitnesses’ to the ‘Holocaust’ tell impossible-to-believe fairy tales. Because they know they will be believed.

              Comment by eah — July 29, 2015 @ 8:24 am

              • I guess only Jewish witnesses can’t be believed. Or any other witness that doesn’t exactly follow your world view.
                The Nazis persecuted many other groups in Europe besides Jews. I guess we can’t believe the Red Army soldiers, gypsies, Poles and others that the Nazis maltreated for their perverted ends.

                Comment by P. O. Truth — July 29, 2015 @ 10:37 am

              • Herr eah! It had been painfull for me to recall the episode of being questioned by those criminals and You express only scepticism. Real survivors – especially when they had been in certain positions – find it painfull to recall events they experienced and their pain increases when they earn that kind of scepticism You, Hermie and some other commentator of this site show. An old survivor asked “How had been possible that a nation at high cultural level committed such actions?” And I could reply that only a murder of high cultural level can set up the necessary organisation and then cancell every evidence. An fault finders like many commentators here ask for forensic evidence. There is more forensic evidence for the Holocaust murder action that for many accusation which in USA Courts – Judge and Jurors full of racial and religious prejudices – sentenced people – mainly negroes – to death and after years or decades it comes out that they had been innocent and evidences had been evaluated in a wrong way. Good bye.

                Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 31, 2015 @ 6:54 am

          • They looked for a pretext to keep me as a hostage in order to pressure my Father who, three days before, found a way to launch a cry for help to the Red Cross. The brave delegates acted suddenly obtaining from SS General Karl Hermann Frank – High SS Comander and Governor of Bohemia-Moravia – the assurance that no one would be brought away from Terezin and then to put the Ghetto under their protection. Frank hoped to find a contact to the Allied Comanders while Eichmann & C. looked for a way to esterminate all of us in that last moment.
            I feel that many comentators (hermie, eah, etc.) regret that the action of the Terezin Elder for survival had success.
            Among the Jewish leaders of the Holocaust period only very few survived – allmost all had been killed; that is historical fact, no fantasy Herr Hermie – and Benjamin Murmelstein had been one of them. The Terezin Ghetto had been the sole where a group of Jews survived. That had been due to help of G’D! There is no other possible explaination Mssr hermie, eah & C.
            In USA You ought to think about Iranian Nazis and ISIS who want to fullfill what the Nazis promised. September 11 2001 had not been a good lesson?

            Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 28, 2015 @ 10:57 pm

            • “They looked for a pretext to keep me as a hostage in order to pressure my Father who, three days before, found a way to launch a cry for help to the Red Cross. ”

              So the SS bosses of the ghetto needed childish pretexts to hold Jewish kids as hostages? Looks like a bad episode of Hogan’s heroes. But as you are a medium, you knew their hidden intention anyway. Your story is getting better and better, wolfie. Bigger and bigger. Thanks for sharing that great piece of comedy with us. Everybody needs a good laugh sometimes.

              “while Eichmann & C. looked for a way to esterminate all of us in that last moment”

              Source for that?

              Warning: “Daddy told me” and your medium powers don’t count.

              “I feel that many comentators (hermie, eah, etc.) regret that the action of the Terezin Elder for survival had success.”

              The typical Jewish bullying “Believe my nonsensical tales without questioning my words or face your status of evil antisemite” again.

              “Herr Hermie! You are ignorant ”

              I find that I have spanked your liar’s ass on this blog a little too often not to laugh at that one. Sorry, wolfie.

              “You ignore that in the Ghetto we had not candies.”

              I don’t ignore that. Too stupid to understand sarcastic jokes, Superior Chosenite? I’m quite disappointed.

              And almost no kids in Europe had any candies at that time. Can your ethnocentrism even hear that?

              Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 7:40 am

              • Herr Hermie-Goebbels jr! While I am exposing fact I lived and remember to well for my psicological health conditions You at Nazi manner use rude and sarcastic expressions. Yes, I confirm that Your comments show a high level of ignorance of those time of darkness and a high level of antisemitism. You speak of “liar’s ass”. So kiss it and join Your nazi comrades in the deepest hell.

                Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 29, 2015 @ 10:40 am

                • ” Yes, I confirm that Your comments show a high level of ignorance”

                  Seeing how often you runned away in past talkings, after I had debunked your lies and exposed your most laughable absurdities, that’s quite hilarious to read.

                  “of those time of darkness”

                  I guess that the so-called darkness of that era is just a matter of perspective. I’m pretty sure that most Germans of that time were – how shall I put it? – breathing more readily without the weight of Jewish aliens dominating and squeezing them. Even if I can understand that the Jewish perspective on those days was quite different. But shouldn’t every thinking and fair man be happy about the liberation of 99% people from the grip of the other 1%? Wasn’t National Socialism in fact real freedom while democracy was/is just a kind of institutionalized enslavement of Goyim not saying its name? (From a Gentile perspective, this deserves to be at least considered, IMO.) Or should the interests and alleged ‘rights’ of a small alien minority be always regarded as something sacred and more important than the well-being of all the others?

                  “and a high level of antisemitism”

                  Agree on that.

                  “You speak of “liar’s ass”. So kiss it and join Your nazi comrades in the deepest hell.”

                  Your mask of gentleman is seemingly cracking, I see. Funny.

                  Are these words for a man of your age, wolfie? Really…😉

                  Comment by hermie — July 29, 2015 @ 3:21 pm

                • It was a time of darkness in Europe unless you were German. A European at that time faced forcible seizure and forced labor in Germany. Europeans faced starvation while Germans seized their food for Germans. Germans stole art and gold reserves from the countries they conquered. I guess those people weren’t breathing so easy while they watched their children starved, their sons and daughters dragged off and their countries looted and bankrupted.
                  That is the freedom your oh so precious Nazis gave to Europe.

                  Comment by P.O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 4:40 am

                • Wars are never a pleasant thing to live. I know that the victors constructed, for reasons very easy to understand (the opposite would have been very surprising), the myth that a world war was the logical and inescapable conclusion of National Socialism. But that’s bullshit. There were very numerous wars before and after National Socialism, and every time life was hard for the peoples touched by those wars. Using the hardships of WW2 to define National Socialism & Nazi Germany is as fallacious as using the hardships of the Anglo-American Zio-wars on Iraq and of the subsequent embargoes on that country to define Saddam Hussein’s policies.

                  A deep analysis of the outbreak of WW2, of the events leading to it, and of the sequence of events during that conflict shows that the leaders of Western democracies (especially America and Britain) and the military junta at the head of Poland were in fact much more to blame for the outbreak of WW2 and its continuation for years than the leaders of Nazi Germany. But one has never seen any victor blame himself for a war and its dreadful conséquences after all. Why would the victors of 1945 and their puppet allies have been any different in this respect?

                  Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 7:27 am

                • You’re right wars are hard. However, previous modern European wars never included the deliberate starvation of 2 million Red Army soldiers in less than a year, the wholesale attempt to destroy Polish leadership and reduce Poland to a nation of slaves, the vicious hunting of alleged partisans that killed hundreds of thousands of innocent men, women and children but in fact found very few weapons and the massacre of millions of innocent Jews based upon the fact they were Jews.
                  I also completely disagree with your assertion that The West was responsible for WW2. Britain and France went out of their way to appease Hitler by giving him what he demanded until they figured out that giving into Hitler only gave him the license to demand more. I agree that a military guarantee of Poland was foolish, the British and French had no intention of interfering in Poland, they simply wanted to deter Hitler’s further expansion. But, the British and French were obligated by treaty once Germany invaded Poland to declare war.
                  So, Germany is responsible for WW2, not the Western allies.

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 10:42 am

                • I want to correct something I said. After WW1 the allies continued to blockade Germany causing many Germans, the numbers into the hundreds of thousands and perhaps millions. They did this to force the Germans to agree to the Versailles Treaty. The same thing happened after WW2 and this conduct is disgraceful. No one was ever prosecuted for these actions. I say this because I try and be fair and balanced. I’ve always said that the allies committed atrocities and no one was ever convicted, at least none that I know, for these atrocities.

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 12:20 pm

                • Correction:
                  Causing many Germans to starve to death.

                  Comment by P. O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 12:21 pm

                • “I also completely disagree with your assertion that The West was responsible for WW2. ”

                  Too bad the Prime Minister of Britain when WW2 broke out, agreed with my ‘assertion’…😉

                  “Chamberlain stated that America and world Jewry forced England into World War II.” – James Forrestal, US Secretary of the Navy (later Secretary of Defense), Diary, December 27, 1945 entry.

                  Comment by hermie — August 4, 2015 @ 8:25 am

              • P.O. Truth: “previous modern European wars never included the deliberate starvation of 2 million Red Army soldiers in less than a year”

                Stalin’s fault. During the war, the Germans made repeated attempts through neutral countries and the International Committee of the Red Cross to reach mutual agreement on the treatment of prisoners by Germany and the USSR. But Stalin always refused to reach such a mutual agreement on the treatment of POWs. Stalin had even ordered the destruction of the Soviet POWs (because he saw the soldiers who had surrendered as traitors – see Stalin’s Order No. 270 below). Moreover a major reason for the terrible fate of the Soviet POWs was the unusual nature of the war on the eastern front, particularly during the first year — June 1941-June 1942 — when vastly greater numbers of prisoners fell into German hands than could possibly be accommodated adequately. And the German POWs didn’t suffer less in Soviet hands. For instance, out of the nearly 110,000 German prisoners captured in Stalingrad, only about 6,000 (5.5%) ever returned.

                Stalin’s Order No. 270:

                If … “instead of organizing resistance to the enemy, some Red Army men prefer to surrender, they shall be destroyed by all possible means, both ground-based and from the air, whereas the families of the Red Army men who have been taken prisoner shall be deprived of the state allowance [that is, rations] and relief.”

                The commanders and political officers … “who surrender to the enemy shall be considered malicious deserters, whose families are liable to be arrested [just] as the families of deserters who have violated the oath and betrayed their Motherland.”

                More here: http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v14/Teplyakov.html (Stalin’s War Against His Own Troops – The Tragic Fate of Soviet Prisoners of War in German Captivity)

                And in April 1945, the Western Allies boasted that they had just killed almost 1,000,000 Germans ‘POWs’ (or more exactly “Disarmed Enemy Forces” (DEF) with no right at all, as ordered by Ike ‘The Terrible Swedish Jew’ Eisenhower) within only 3 weeks !!

                http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blogspot.be/2011/05/allies-boast-of-killing-1000000-german.html?zx=30ee1920e4d86787

                Hard to compete with that…

                P.O. Truth: “the wholesale attempt to destroy Polish leadership and reduce Poland to a nation of slaves”

                Are you serious? Looks like a chronicle of England’s colonial policies.

                P.O. Truth: “the vicious hunting of alleged partisans that killed hundreds of thousands of innocent men, women and children but in fact found very few weapons”

                Vicious hunting? Do you know how many German soliders were killed by your beloved partisans? Between 500,000 and over 1,000,000 (according to Soviet sources, for what Soviet allegations are worth). US vets of the Viet Nam war could probably explain how hard it is to fight against guerilla fighters. And the Geneva convention stipulated that such non-uninformed fighters were illegal precisely to avoid the worsening of civilians’ plight in war areas.

                P.O. Truth: “I also completely disagree with your assertion that The West was responsible for WW2….”

                Nice regurgitation of the orthodox storyline. Congratulations. But you’d better study that topic even deeper…

                Comment by hermie — July 30, 2015 @ 3:03 pm

                • It’s just easier to give you links:http://military.wikia.com/wiki/Commissar_Orderhttp://military.wikia.com/wiki/Nazi_crimes_against_Soviet_POWs
                  You can also read about this in Timothy Snyder’s Bloodlands, Europe between Stalin and Hitler.
                  I’m well aware of the actions against his own POWs. No one, least of all me, denies that Stalin was a vicious dictator. I’m also aware that up to a million German POWs died in Soviet camps.
                  As for the partisans, I’m aware that partisans are not protected by military law. But hunting down partisans is not an excuse for killing innocent men, women and children. http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=2006
                  Basically in one operation the Germans killed thousands and seized 47 weapons. Naturally all of the partisans got away.

                  Comment by P.O. Truth — July 30, 2015 @ 7:13 pm

                • “hunting down partisans is not an excuse for killing innocent men, women and children.”

                  That’s the other side of the coin of guerilla warfare, the inescapable consequence of the Partisans’ methods of warfare. [IMO, the death of numerous Soviet civilians in German-occupied areas was Stalin’s goal with his partisan units, that in order to prevent any fraternization between the German forces there and the local civilians (many of whom hated Stalin and he knew that). Stalin crucially needed to prevent the Soviet populations from regarding the German forces as liberators. And that’s exactly what Stalin’s Partisan warfare and the German necessary counter-measures on the eastern front brought.] But if you have new innovative methods to combat guerilla warfare, feel free to share them with us. I’m quite sure that most armies in the world would be very happy to know your proposals, professor.

                  Comment by hermie — July 31, 2015 @ 6:15 am

            • I feel that many comentators (hermie, eah, etc.) regret that the action of the Terezin Elder for survival had success

              Wolf, I am not an anti-Semite, and I wish no one harm. So I resent this remark. But I was not surprised by it.

              After some years of looking into it, I no longer believe the common ‘Holocaust’ story. Because: convincing forensic evidence is just not there; too many of the eyewitness accounts are not at all believable; and some of claimed happenings are physically impossible (recall your “geheime Reichsache”).

              Try to remember this.

              Comment by eah — July 29, 2015 @ 11:26 pm

              • Here is the difference of opinion. You tell of lack of forensic evidence. Cleraly that time docuents are written in Nazi Deutsch difficult to understand and many archives had been destructed by the SS before war end. I myself remember at Terezin archif material loaded on camions and brought to be burnt on the court yard of an SS barack; great concern for the Head of the Ghetto Fire Brigade. In many Anihalation Camps the Gas Chambers had been destructed before the arrival of the Red Army, and so forth.
                I myself – an eyewitness (!) – replied to an Italian TV journalist that I could not confirm his thesis about a question at Terezin; I had trouble and needed the assistance of a lawyer. In my opinion the eye witnesses had been questioned in a wrong manner whithout the necessary consideration of the traumas they had suffered.
                The certain fact is that the large Jewish Comunities of East, Central and South Europe disappeared in the years 1939.1945. How many Jews had been killed in the Gas Chambers, trough mass shootings, through forced labor and death marches, trough deseases and starvation in the overcrowded Ghettoes is matter of research. The total figure of at least 6.000.000 cannot be denied.
                Furthermore You ought to consider the Nazi Doctrine called for the destruction of the Jewish; first step had been forced emigration and then deportation and mass killings.
                Good bye.

                Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 30, 2015 @ 6:46 am

                • an eyewitness (!)

                  An eyewitness to what? What did you see, Wolf? Did you witness people being gassed to death with Zyklon-B?

                  Comment by eah — July 30, 2015 @ 6:49 am

                • For “eah”. At last days of April 1945 I have seen files throven out of windows on a camion while an SS man stood there to controll that nothing had been left. I never claimed to have seen gassings of Jews or others but I remember persons who left Terezin and did not return. Some of my relatives survived Auschwitz while others disappeared at Auschwitz or elsewhere we never could know.
                  Yes, I met with survivors who avoided to speack about things while others had difficulty to recall their traumatic experiences. I listened only what those victim had been ready to tell and never put questions.
                  Yes, I am considered an eyewitness and as a special child survivor I had granted interviews even to German researchers who paid me a visit at Ladispoli, Italy.
                  Only Antisemites lack of respect for traumatic experiences many Jews passed through and to the deadth toll no one can deny unless wanting to ignite trouble spraying hatred. Clear?

                  Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 30, 2015 @ 9:35 am

                • I never claimed to have seen gassings of Jews or others but I remember persons who left Terezin and did not return.

                  I see. And because they left and did not return that means to you that they were gassed?

                  Comment by eah — July 30, 2015 @ 1:16 pm

          • Herr Hermie! You are ignorant and illmannered. You ignore that in the Ghetto we had not candies. So asking a little boy about his favorite candie sort they could see whether the Father had had or not “contacts with outside the Ghetto”. At that time a jewish leader could be killed for any pretext and moment; so every call to Komandatur/Headquarter could mean that. Your way to make ironical remarks shows lack of respect for basic human feelings.
            Note that I could talk with former Wehrmacht soldiers – who too feared the SS – and other persons who that time stood at the other side. But those persons knew what they were talking about while You ignore fact and things of that time.

            Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 29, 2015 @ 5:19 am

    • Whenever I read a comment by you, I am reminded of Mel Mermelstein, the author of ‘By Bread Alone’. Mel Mermelstein was referenced in part two of the three part documentary by David McCalden on his 1987 trip to Auschwitz-Birkenau and other Polish ‘death camps’.

      The videos can be sourced online, and are well worth any serious Holocaust scholar’s time.

      Comment by Anaxarchus — July 29, 2015 @ 8:43 am

  6. The extent to which these coin operated crybabies have used the terrible power of their bottomless purse to re-engineer the post-WWII Christian West into a global technological plantation of consumer and debt slaves who willingly kill innocents to preserve their bondage, on foreign soil and in the streets of the capital cities of America and Europe, is beyond the comprehension of even the most educated among us ….” The move earned praise from the World Jewish Congress, an international federation of Jewish communities and organizations. “We congratulate President Iohannis for his strong stand against fascism, anti-Semitism and racism,” WJC President Ronald Lauder said in a statement on Thursday. “Only by fighting Holocaust denial and fascism at the highest levels can a nation effectively counter the troubling spread of anti-Semitism across Europe.”
    Why Romania Had to Ban Holocaust Denial Twice https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2015/07/27/why-romania-had-to-ban-holocaust-denial-twice/

    Comment by who dares wings — July 27, 2015 @ 10:17 am

    • What do You mean when mentioning “these coin operated crybabies have used the terrible power of their bottomless purse to re-enginner the post WWII Christian West into a global technological platation of consumer and debt slaves”? By the way please note that the LEHMANN BANK, collapsed in 2008 with large world wide effects, had been since 1969 purely aryan owned and the other mortgage bank which collapsed in 2009 had been owned by a Latino business men.

      Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 27, 2015 @ 10:36 am

      • Wolf, Jews dominate global finance — simple as that. Do a bit of research and answer this simple question: When was the last time the head of the Federal Reserve, the most powerful central bank in the world, was not a Jew?

        Comment by eah — July 29, 2015 @ 11:06 pm

        • I remeber Greenspan but not the names or religion/race of his followers. In my opinion Congress ought to make possible for Federal Reserve to perform better tightening the controll of Big Banks and other financial companies. The LEHMANN BROS since 1969 had been pure aryan; as long it had been jewish owned it helped the marketing of USA South State agricoltural products. Morgan, Rockfeller, etc. are White Protestant and Anglosaxon. By the way as long as the Popes entrusted the Jew Rothshild their money had been well managed; as soon they had the Mass attender Sindona and other similar gus they lost a lot o money. In Germany the Dresdner Bank, the Deutsche Bank, etc. had been strictly aryan controlled and made a gross profit so in WWI as WWII. But the accusation of Jewish controll on global finance is an antisemite tale and had many very bad effects. Good bye.

          Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 30, 2015 @ 6:24 am

        • The tale of Jews dominating global finance is one of the many antisemite propaganda pieces leading in the years to the Holocaust mass killings. When You start recalling such pieces of propaganda and then express harsh scepticism when I painfully recall facts I lived through so I can consider You at least as hostile and driven by antisemite prejudice. Look, some one can be driven by prejudices against Jews without being aware that this is, indeed, the first step of antisemitism.

          Comment by Wolf Murmelstein — July 31, 2015 @ 3:22 am

  7. It’s all about publicity to keep the Holocaust in the news, to make the guilt we should all feel, fresh and relevant today. Money is of course what drives these jews.

    Comment by Clent — July 27, 2015 @ 10:09 am

  8. His conviction will be upheld, but I doubt he will spend time in prison. There is a concept in German jurisprudence — such as it is — whereby a sentence need not be served — this is called (among other things) “Strafaussetzung zur Bewährung”. As long as he behaves himself, he will not have to spend any time incarcerated (eine Freiheitsstrafe antreten). Brief info re this (in German) can be found here. IMO, this is the most likely outcome for Herr Groening.

    Comment by eah — July 27, 2015 @ 9:30 am


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