Scrapbookpages Blog

March 23, 2016

The Holocaust according to Daniel Goldhagen

Filed under: Germany, Holocaust — Tags: , — furtherglory @ 8:41 am

One of the regular readers of my blog wrote a comment in which Daniel Goldhagen was mentioned. Daniel Goldhagen is a Holocaust expert who has written several books, including a book entitled Hitler’s Willing Executioners. His book was one of the first books that I read when I began studying the Holocaust.

I quoted from Daniel Goldhagen’s book on my scrapbookpages.com website, which I began writing in 1998:

Begin quote from Goldhagen’s book:

 

“During the Holocaust, Germans extinguished the lives of six million Jews and, had Germany not been defeated, would have annihilated millions more. The Holocaust was also the defining feature of German politics and political culture during the Nazi period, the most shocking event of the twentieth century, and the most difficult to understand in all of German history. The Germans’ persecution of the Jews culminating in the Holocaust is thus the central feature of Germany during the Nazi period. It is so not because we are retrospectively shocked by the most shocking event of the century, but because of what it meant to Germans at the time and why so many of them contributed to it.”

Daniel Jonah Goldhagen, Hitler’s Willing Executioners, Ordinary Germans and the Holocaust

End quote

I decided to look Goldhagen up on Wikipedia. I was amazed to learn that Goldhagen has a page on Wikipedia which has a section entitled  Criticism, which I am quoting:

Begin quote

Criticism

The book [Hitler’s Willing Executioners] sparked controversy in the press and academic circles. Some historians have characterized its reception as an extension of the Historikerstreit, the German historiographical debate of the 1980s that sought to explain Nazi history.[26] The book was a “publishing phenomenon”,[27] achieving fame in both the United States and Germany despite being criticized by some historians,[28][29][30][31][32] who called it ahistorical and,[33] according to Holocaust historian Raul Hilberg, “totally wrong about everything” and “worthless.”[34][35] Due to its alleged “generalizing hypothesis” about Germans, it has been characterized as anti-German.[36][37][38] The Israeli historian Yehuda Bauer claims that “Goldhagen stumbles badly,” and

Does not seem to be acquainted with some basic developments in German society in the nineteenth century. Certainly, there was what he calls eliminationist antisemitism and its impact increased as the century matured…But antisemitism came in different forms, and Goldhagen puts all antisemitism in the same basket, including the liberal type that wanted to see the Jews disappear by assimilation and conversion…The vast majority of German antisemitics did not wish to abolish formal Jewish emancipation. Goldhagen makes much of the radical antisemitism of the Conservative Party in Germany; but in 1893 it obtained less than 10 percent of the votes, whereas the National Liberals, among whom there were a number of former Jews, were much more numerous. Goldhagen ignores this and makes the counterfactual statement that “conservatives and völkisch nationalists in Germany…formed the vast majority of the population.

End quote from Wikipedia

 

80 Comments »

  1. You gotta love historians. Better part of them were not even involved in the historical event,of which they write. In this case,I’m referring to that idiot Bauer. His family hauled ass and made it to Palestine. So everything he knows of the holo,is second hand. Even when survivors are interviewed for historical purposes,they can tell some tall tales. Super Jew seems to pop up in every survivor story. The one I like is where a few hundred Jews walk through a minefield and come out unscathed. I had the misfortune of being on point one time and walking right on top of a mine. The things ain’t that easy to dodge. Yet the Jews walked right on through there. Bauer wants to wag his finger. How do we know Bauer ain’t full of shit. It always seems like if a Jew said it,then it’s the holy gospel. Like I like to say,history is written by those who write it. Too much obfuscation

    Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 12:47 pm

    • Actually Tim the quote is the victors write the history.

      JR

      Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 12:54 pm

      • I’ve heard it both ways. You could make the argument that the Jews were victors. Both ways make sense. This fool I spoke about here wrote and the sheep fell right In line with it. The Jews were victorious in the long run,so the Jew wrote the history there.

        Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 2:00 pm

        • You right on about that Tim…..

          JR

          Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 2:02 pm

          • Well it’s the truth. Like I said,I don’t fall on either side here. I’m just trying to understand it. I’m just trying to figure out the holo denial laws. What is their “real” purpose. This shit almost reminds me of Capt. McVey ( you remember him. He Skippered the Indianapolis ) . The only thing he kept asking at his trial was,”why the hell didn’t anyone come pick my men up”. Nobody could give the man an answer. So in 2000 he was cleared of everything,but that was the proverbial,”too little,too late”. He blew his brains out back in ’68. Thats why this shit reminds of the holo laws. Instead of a bunch of navy big dogs sitting around deciding what they want to hear and not hear at trial, it’s the law givers once again either ignoring or saying what is and what isn’t . Shit they had that niponese man that skippered the sub that sank the Indy,at the trial. Clearly they didn’t listen to him. He told these fools he fired a spread. Didn’t matter if McVey zig zagged all over hells half acre,he was a dead man. The ship was going down regardless . So the navy chose what they wanted,instead of all the facts. Same thing here. If anyone tries to bring up something that contradicts the “official version” BAM. They just became part of the Bighouse crew. I read from a link either you or Jeff sent me about the diamond lady. She’d swallow the diamonds each day,then shit em out the next. From what the article said,in so many words,her survivor story is mostly BS. That came from some of the other survivors. They said she’s stealing parts of “their story”,just to imbellish her story. That’s f–led up when the Jews got their own stealing from them. Is that why they don’t want folks questioning the holo? They may find out the people that supposed to be spreading the gospel,are lying? I’m not gonna deny,something happened. That was a war. F–ked up shit happens in a war. The magnitude of what “actually” happened,will never be known. However,if people don’t want to seriously examine everything,the truth is never gonna be known . It’s like I’ve done give up on the numbers here. They keep changing. I think I’ll just try and figure out certain events dealing with this topic. Unlike the holo denial laws,I welcome facts from either side on this topic. I’ll try to draw my own conclusion and maybe put it under the spotlight here,so people might tell me if on the right path or not

            Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 3:01 pm

  2. Hypocrisy, thy name is…J-w. Aka Why Holocausts Happen, part II. https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/rania-khalek/video-aipac-attendees-slam-netanyahus-racism-when-they-think-its-trumps

    Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 12:36 pm

    • PS this reminds me of a time I was on the air with “Michael Medved” and I started quoting outrageous atrocities against civilian resistance fighters. He immediately thought I was giving examples of Israeli war crimes against Palestinians in the Intifada and of course began to justify them all. When I revealed I was reading from a book about SS actions in the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising of 1943, he dropped my call and went to commercial. Yuk yuk yuk

      Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 12:46 pm

  3. re David Irving.These links make for some interesting and prurient reading and aren’t very flattering. 1. David irving An Autopsy by Dr. Karl Kolcheck http://www.crow96.20m.com/ 2. David Irving Appears to be Jewish by Miles W. Mathis http://mileswmathis.com/irving.pdf 3. David irving is Jewish! by John “Birdman” Bryant http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/NetLoss/Irving/Irving-IrvingIsJewish-GermarRudolf.html 4. Unmasking David Irving by Alexander Baron https://archive.org/details/UnmaskingIrving.

    Comment by who dares wings — March 23, 2016 @ 12:25 pm

    • Ah, how quickly deniers turn on their own…..

      Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 12:28 pm

      • “Ah, how quickly deniers turn on their own…..” Ah, but David Cole-Stein, Mark Weber, David Irving and Christian Lidntner http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2011/10/interview-with-ex-denier-christian.html are not Holocaust deniers. Not since David Cole-Stein’s tell-all REPUBLICAN PARTY ANIMAL was published, anyway. He divided Holocaust heresy intotwo new camps – “revisionists” (contrite white hats who believe up two million Jews were mass murdered by the Einsatzgruppen and in the Reinhardt camps) and “deniers” (evil black hats who believe some were certainly shot and hanged for collaborating with the enemy, others died of disease, but none were forced by Dr. Joseph Mengle to blay BINGO with red BINGO card daubers filled with their family’s blood.

        Comment by who dares wings — March 23, 2016 @ 12:56 pm

        • “Dr. Joseph Mengle to blay BINGO with red BINGO card daubers filled with their family’s blood.”

          Careful, now.
          Jim will actually believe that someone said that and will add it in with his obsession over steam chambers, shrunken heads and skin lampshades.

          Jeff

          Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 1:03 pm

          • Jeff….since you seem to agree with shrunken heads, steam chambers, and lampshades what more can I say…..

            JR

            Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 1:11 pm

            • I don’t, Jim.
              The stories of steam chambers, etc. were rumors started by witnessing not understanding what they were seeing.
              It’s not like the SS gave guided tours.
              “Here is the ramp, here is where we store all of the stuff we steal from the Jews, here’s the gas chamber……..”
              Jeff

              Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 3:08 pm

              • As I recall, the Nazis did give guided tours of Dachau. I wrote about this on my website and on my blog, but I can’t find it now. Clergymen were brought to Dachau and given tours. I have a photo of this somewhere on my website, but I can’t find it now.

                Comment by furtherglory — March 23, 2016 @ 3:25 pm

                • Where did steam chambers pop up. First time I’ve heard. Then again that’s why I’m here,to learn

                  Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 3:30 pm

                • Maybe Dachau.
                  Not Treblinka.

                  Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 3:33 pm

      • how quickly

        Actually, “4”, Unmasking David Irving, was published in 1994 — “1” in 1996 — “3” in 2004 — only one piece was published recently (in 2015), ie after Irving ‘saw the light’.

        You f-u-c-k-i-n-g i-d-i-o-t. You’re like a monkey on a keyboard.

        Comment by eah — March 23, 2016 @ 12:59 pm

        • how quickly

          “Actually, “4”, Unmasking David Irving, was published in 1994 — “1” in 1996 — “3” in 2004 — only one piece was published recently (in 2015), ie after Irving ‘saw the light’.”

          Sorry, I don’t keep up with David Irving’s bullshit. I also said that I hadn’t watched the video yet.

          “You f-u-c-k-i-n-g i-d-i-o-t. You’re like a monkey on a keyboard.”

          Hey eah!!!! I’m glad you replied to me!!!!

          I wanted to wish you Happy Douchebag Day!!!!!!!
          That’s right, this is the one day of the year we celebrate douchebags who are dicks writing in on blogs. You know, the type of people who treat treat blog replies like term papers and self-righteously correct grammar and spelling mistakes.
          You know, you.

          Happy Douchebag Day, eah. You’ve earned it.

          You are still really grouchy, Nancy.
          Ggggrrrrrrrr.
          Did your favorite Taylor Swift CD get scratched and now you can’t listen to it?
          I’m sorry.
          I realize that Taylor Swift is favorite of all douchebag prom queens everywhere.

          Have a nice day Nancy.

          Jeff

          Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 1:12 pm

          • The reason why you are a p-i-e-c-e o-f s-h-i-t is on full display here: when called out for the utter bullshit you all-too-regularly post, you never acknowledge that what you posted was bullshit.

            Comment by eah — March 23, 2016 @ 1:16 pm

            • “The reason why you are a p-i-e-c-e o-f s-h-i-t is on full display here: when called out for the utter bullshit you all-too-regularly post, you never acknowledge that what you posted was bullshit.”

              LANGUAGE!!!! That’s not very ladylike, Nancy.

              Someone owes a quarter to the swear jar.

              Seriously, just go to Amazon and get the CD again. Or just download it.
              Or, watch the videos on YouTube. That way you can watch your favorite princess.

              There, you see. That’ll get you as right as rain.
              Then you can have a cup of tea and some cookies. That should turn that frown upside down.

              Your friend,
              Jeff

              Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 1:35 pm

              • Tea and cookies. You got to be British .

                Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 2:07 pm

                • No, not British.
                  I just suggested them to eah because she seemed particularly pouty today.
                  Jeff

                  Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 3:02 pm

                • In that case, a shot of Bombay and a six pack of Lone Star Beer ( I live in Texas so I’m gonna have to suggest Lone Star). That’ll turn that frown around

                  Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 3:28 pm

                • particularly pouty

                  I’m not “pouty”, you prick — I’m just sick of reading your bullshit — coupled with your obnoxious, know-it-all persona — the way you spam nearly every post here with your comments full of useless drivel — next time, maybe actually have the decency to read the the links posted in a comment before replying like a monkey — how quickly deniers — even the one piece published recently has nothing to do with Irving no longer being a “denier” — and the person who wrote it is very clearly not a “denier” — if you had bothered to read the link that would have been apparent — this means your comment was 100% bullshit.

                  You fucking jerk.

                  Comment by eah — March 23, 2016 @ 3:30 pm

                • “I’m not “pouty”, you prick — I’m just sick of reading your bullshit — coupled with your obnoxious, know-it-all persona — the way you spam nearly every post here with your comments full of useless drivel — next time, maybe actually have the decency to read the the links posted in a comment before replying like a monkey — how quickly deniers — even the one piece published recently has nothing to do with Irving no longer being a “denier” — and the person who wrote it is very clearly not a “denier” — if you had bothered to read the link that would have been apparent — this means your comment was 100% bullshit.

                  You fucking jerk.”

                  😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱

                  You know, that sort of anger is not good for your blood pressure.

                  You also owe more quarters for the swear jar.

                  You are having a major shit fit there, Nancy.

                  You still haven’t taken my advice:

                  Bath, tea, Taylor Swift.

                  Maybe a cool wash cloth for your brow.

                  It probably wouldn’t help if I said Fred Leuchter was a fraud who wouldn’t know a Nazi gas chamber if one bit him in the ass.

                  I won’t say it, then.

                  Your pal,
                  Jeff

                  Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 3:40 pm

                • Go easy. This person can’t tell difference between 2 of us. I think this person called you a denier. That’s way off from the truth

                  Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 5:12 pm

                • You responded to the wrong person . Hell. My name ain’t even spelled close to his

                  Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 5:10 pm

                • @Tim

                  You responded to the wrong person

                  To help you out — I put some text of the comment I was replying to in italics — particularly pouty — this text was not written by you — therefore I was not replying to you — note: at a certain point, the “Reply” option is no longer offered — this is to limit the level of indentation — since it was not possible for me to “Reply”, I excerpted text to indicate the comment I was targeting — that make sense, right?

                  This person can’t tell difference between 2 of us.

                  Doch — I can tell the difference — you are the one who is confused.

                  I think this person called you a denier

                  You also need to work on your reading comprehension — I did not call anyone a “denier”.

                  Comment by eah — March 24, 2016 @ 3:17 am

                • Interesting use of the German word “Doch”. You have to hear this word pronounced to get the full effect of it.

                  Comment by furtherglory — March 24, 2016 @ 9:04 am

                • Hey is “doch”, pronounced the same as “dak”? Like In Dak To of the Kon Tum province of the former south. Let me ask you a question. What’s the story behind the letter ( not to confused with “the letter” by Joe Cocker ha ha) that Gandhi write to hitler? He said he admired hitlers devotion to his people and country. He also told hitler,he didn’t think he was the monster everyone made him out to be. I ran across this on a site called,”abundanthope.net”

                  Comment by Tim — March 24, 2016 @ 9:34 am

                • i got the right person. You responded to me over the tea and cookies comment that I left for “Jeff “,not you. I know you got the wrong person when you said “reading my bullshit”. I’m always asking questions. I don’t argue with people on here. If you’ve ever read anything “I’ve written”,you’d know that . I’ve stated plenty of times,I’m here trying to figure this shit out. I don’t take sides here. I’ve only said that a half a billion times . You don’t tea and cookies. You need to go to Walgreens for a box of tampons. Watch you’re language in the future little lady. What kind eah? The nearest I’ve ever heard to that would be “Eli”,but that was from an old 3 dog night song.

                  Comment by Tim — March 24, 2016 @ 9:12 am

                • You responded to me over the tea and cookies comment that I left for “Jeff “,not you.

                  @Tim: Uhh, no, I did not — first, read my above comment to you again, this time carefully — now I will try again — it just looks like I replied to you — because my comment is underneath a comment of yours — it looks that way because I could not reply to the “particulary pouty” comment — I could not reply to that comment because the “Reply” option is not available on that comment — due to the max allowed indentation level being reached, as I already explained — so I had to reply under your ‘tea and cookies’ comment — rhetorical question: are you really so dense? — kaum zu glauben, aber es sieht so aus.

                  You need to go to Walgreens for a box of tampons. Watch you’re language in the future little lady.

                  Well, since you included this bit: I would normally never, ever reply to anything you write here — have I ever done so before? — answer: no — I don’t because you are juvenile — you write like someone who never left junior high school — I just skip over your comments — the best I can say about you is that you are somewhat less annoying than the person who now comments here as “Jeff” (he has used several different monikers in the past).

                  Comment by eah — March 24, 2016 @ 9:41 am

                • My comments I leave are always questions. You said you skip over my comments. If you do that,how the hell do you know what I write? You said you breeze past my comments. Like I said,I don’t leave comments like everyone else. I’m asking questions to try and understand this whole topic better. You don’t need to insult me poindexter. I got my HS diploma. I hit the MEPS center the following week. You seem to fit those couple lines from an old Hendrix song. ” I know you’ll probably scream and cry,that your little world won’t let you go,but who in your measly little world are you trying to prove that,you’re made outta gold and can’t be sold”. Get a grip. You wouldn’t survive the real world. You remind me of this lil shit that was on here a couple days ago. His mouth had a bad case of the runs. He was talking shit about a war and its participants he knew nothing about

                  Comment by Tim — March 24, 2016 @ 10:07 am

                • “about you is that you are somewhat less annoying than the person who now comments here as “Jeff” (he has used several different monikers in the past).”

                  Aaaawwwww, how nice. You mentioned me.

                  You must have taken my advice:
                  Bath, tea, Taylor Swift.

                  Does that mean you are ready to be Facebook friends?

                  Your friend,
                  Jeff (aka PO Truth, aka, HCW, aka HAD)

                  Comment by Jeff K. — March 24, 2016 @ 6:11 pm

                • See. Yee haa accused me of leaving the “tea” comment. It was you. Then Yee Haa said he ( or she),never reads my comments,because I never have nothing to say. Well how the hell is Yee Haa gonna know what I have to say,or don’t have to say if this person never reads my comments? Well Yee Haa claims to be such an egghead,That he ( or she),has the ability to read a persons thoughts,unlike us lower life forms.

                  Comment by Tim — March 25, 2016 @ 8:28 am

                • @Tim:

                  You don’t need to insult me poindexter

                  Dude, you started it — I said what I did only because of your “tampons” and “little lady” remarks — in fact, I said so explicitly — are you so blind and dishonest?? — how the hell do you know — of course I saw enough in the past — You wouldn’t survive the real world — you’ve made this sort of comment before (not to me) — I can only say: WTF?! — how would you know? — like I said: you are juvenile — I’m ‘surviving the real world’ fine, thanks.

                  At least I hope you now understand that before I was not replying to you.

                  Comment by eah — March 24, 2016 @ 10:21 am

                • You want to insult me by questioning my level of education. You have the high brow attitude towards my comments. You’re the one who said you skate past them,because I’ve nothing to say. Like I said,how the hell do you know what I say,if you don’t read what I say. You’re not hard to figure. You feel comfortable here. You know what’s going on. I told I’m here to learn. You earned the tampon comment,because you got the ball rolling here. When I say the real world,I’m talking street level. Not some BS reality show. I show you where I’ve been,you’d cringe. I made the real world ( probably not those exact words), because once again,somebody was talking shit to me. You probably read the comment that lil shit left me,about my service in Nam,when I was in country. Accused me of saying I’m swinging my dick acting like I’m a war hero. I had to drop his dumb ass. He’s seen too many Rambo movies. I told him the truth was,we were survivors nothing more. We just wanted to put in our time and get the hell outta Dodge. Next my ex wife,volunteering to be sent to Nam,was the biggest damn mistake of my life. So if you’re referring to my comment that I left to that lil piece of shit,then that’s your explanation. All though I don’t owe you one. Well the word denier popped up in the comment you left for me. Maybe you do need to read what I write. You’ll see I’m not on either side here. Like I say,I’m just trying to figure out what really happened with this shit. I tell people I thought I knew what a confusing war was. Nam ain’t got shit on the lies that WW2 has spawned. To be honest with you,neither one of us are in the right here. Oh well. Play time is over. The vets here. Gotta go flush some dams

                  Comment by Tim — March 24, 2016 @ 11:24 am

          • I thought they all liked Shania Twat. I’m just here trying to understand this better. It just gets more confusing. Have you heard from your buddy sclong lately? Yeah . The one who knows everything about war.

            Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 2:05 pm

  4. Norman Finklestein and a Canadian Jewess Ruth Bettina Birn wrote a critique of Goldhagen’s Hitler’s Willing Executioner’s and his thesis that ALL Germans were guilty of the Holocaust. This was Finklestein’s first book and published before The Holocaust Industry. I stumbled on a copy at Borders Books before that chain disappeared.
    A NATION ON TRIAL http://www.barnesandnoble.com/p/a-nation-on-trial-norman-g-finkelstein/1114593647/2673546253070?st=PLA&sid=BNB_DRS_Marketplace+Shopping+Professional_00000000&2sid=Google_&sourceId=PLGoP3644&k_clickid=3×3644

    Goldhagen Tries to Quash Critic Harvard Crimson http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1998/1/21/goldhagen-tries-to-quash-critic-seeks/

    Norman Finklestein’s arch enemy Alan Dershowitz who got him fired from De Paul University after Finklestein proved he’d plagerized his book CHUTZPAH (Finklestein’s severence pay was probably in the six figures so don’t waste your tears) is currently in hot water. His first wife’s death was rather mysterious. http://www.palmbeachdailynews.com/news/news/crime-law/judge-rules-against-dershowitz-in-defamation-case-/npn6d/

    Comment by who dares wings — March 23, 2016 @ 12:13 pm

    • Finkelstein is a decent fellow (as far as can be said for a far-left Jew). However, he is overall been kind and honorable in my interactions with him and is currently broke as he is blacklisted from work.

      Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 12:29 pm

  5. Goldhagen is simply a jewish supremacist with a blind spot that many if not most Jews have–their self-deception makes them unable to understand their actions are the main cause of “anti-Semitism” throughout history, as articles like this one (and its attachments) so ably demonstrate: http://newobserveronline.com/top-jew-slams-euro-patriots/

    Of course…he neglects “Stalin’s Willing Executioners”…http://www.kevinmacdonald.net/SlezkineRev.pdf

    Irving has not changed his overall opinion on things or people, or Hitler’s knowledge of the so-called Holocaust. He does however believe that Korherr and Hofle confirm that some people were in fact liquidated in Aktion Reinhardt and that those documents are as close to a confirmation as one will find.

    He also is a bit aloof, moody, eccentric, and self-deceived into thinking that “Himmler” will somehow restore him to mainstream acceptance and he’ll regain the status his ego so desperately craves. He should know…the other side never, ever forgives or forgets.

    Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 10:51 am

    • He’s clearly departed from sound thinking and reasoning. He rejects the obvious question of HOW IS IT POSSIBLE TO ACCOMPLISH MASS EXECUTIONS THAT ARE REQUIRED TO SUPPORT THIS mistaken notion? As J. Rizoli stated and quoted when asking Mark Weber about this, he said, “I don’t know”. Irving said, “I don’t know and I don’t care.” For someone who ‘goes to the Archives” (not all information especially from the Soviets is reliable), NO INFO to support his contention is quite a departure from the SOP.

      Comment by Diane King — March 23, 2016 @ 11:51 am

    • @Schlageter

      Didn’t you – who knows David Irving personally – once said that Mr. Irving is somehow going senile now? Could you tell us a little bit more about that?

      Schlageter wrote: “self-deceived into thinking that “Himmler” will somehow restore him to mainstream acceptance and he’ll regain the status his ego so desperately craves. He should know…the other side never, ever forgives or forgets.”

      The Zionist Lobby needs him too much as the [alleged] champion of ‘Holocaust denial’ defeated before a court by Lipstadt’s dogs, to let him go and restore his lost respectability and public acceptance…

      Comment by hermie — March 23, 2016 @ 2:56 pm

      • He’s become very moody and cantankerous, often getting angry at many of the people who pay money to listen or accompany him on his talks and tours.
        He’s getting forgetful, and is easily angered, and when he does, he retreats into a shell and stops talking altogether.

        Many of his talks are “canned ” now, as if he is an old singer who has memorized a few of his certain old songs and can sing them upon request, but knows no new ones.

        Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 3:59 pm

        • Still, that’s takes nothing away from his writing, which I’ve found to be the best of any historian I’ve ever read, and his research abilities, which are second to none

          Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 4:03 pm

          • OK. Thank you for this information, Schlag.

            Comment by hermie — March 24, 2016 @ 7:21 pm

  6. The video up there is the 2 hr one so you have to go into it an hr to see his Holocaust ramblings…
    I thought I put the shorter version up lets see if this is the one

    Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 10:20 am

  7. You can be happy to know David Irving has joined the Exterminationist group on Holocaust deaths….
    My question to all of them please show me how it worked…..sprinkling some ZB on the heads of people is pretty lame…..Steaming them like lobsters is more lame….Carbon Monoxide Dioxide whatever even lamer. People can throw all sorts of numbers around like chicken feed please show me a working Homicidal gas chamber.
    Why haven’t they done a mock homicidal death chamber? They seem to do these type of things with all large deaths, and even single ones.
    They haven’t done so because they can’t…… the mock up wouldn’t work.
    David Irving’s revised Revisionism…..I cut the video down from 2hrs to one for your viewing pleasure…just put in the Holocaust stuff.

    JR

    Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 9:56 am

    • I have written about David Irving on several blog posts:
      https://furtherglory.wordpress.com/tag/david-irving/

      I believe that David Irving is tying to save his career and his source of income – his books.

      Comment by furtherglory — March 23, 2016 @ 10:07 am

      • About David Irving’s career…..If you don’t go along with the 6 million lie or the part about making Hitler on par with Satan the Devil…than there is no way you can reconcile with the HoloHuxster community.
        They don’t forget….They want exclusive worship for the 6 million lie. So to David… nice try, see you in Goy Hell, the good news is some of us will be there with you.
        In that video David says several time that Hitler was kept in the dark about the Jews and what was happening to them.
        JR

        Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 10:18 am

      • I have to agree, FG. SORRY, SORRY tactic. Who’s he trying to convince, trying to prove!

        Comment by Diane King — March 23, 2016 @ 11:18 am

      • David Irving has simply had to trim his sails over the latter years, due to the very stormy waters that he’s been forced to navigate through.

        I believe that its more than likely that he was even visited by British government agents to warn him off tackling the holocaust issue. They were aghast at Irving’s controversial stance on Auschwitz – where he was very publicly demolishing it brick by brick – “Sink The Auschwitz” was his slogan! But the UK government couldn’t allow a distinguished WW2 historian ( which he certainly was at that time ) to completely debunk the holocaust myth, because its a central plank of Western orthodoxy and belief. If he was to set about destroying the image of the Rheinhardt camps as well – then then ain’t much of a holohoax left, folks.

        These agents would have approached him politely and discretely, and say to him;- “Mr Irving, Her Majesty’s Government takes a very dim view of your stance upon this matter, and requests and requires that you desist from your activities in this arena. Irving would have understood the veiled threat, and being an admirer of the English class system ( a bit of a snob? ) would have readily and obediently backed off in deference to the power of the British establishment.

        Comment by Talbot — March 23, 2016 @ 12:33 pm

        • “These agents would have approached him politely and discretely, and say to him;- “Mr Irving, Her Majesty’s Government takes a very dim view of your stance upon this matter, and requests and requires that you desist from your activities in this arena. Irving would have understood the veiled threat, and being an admirer of the English class system ( a bit of a snob? ) would have readily and obediently backed off in deference to the power of the British establishment.”

          Irving made his career on being a maverick and thumbing his nose at the establishment, including historians.

          However, you may be right, Talbot.
          I bet the group that approached him included Eichman, freshly tanned from sunning himself on Isreali beaches. Maybe Prince Charles and the Queen dropped in as well.
          Perhaps Led Zeppelin reunited for the occasion, with Bonham’s son on drums.
          I bet that was a helluva good concert.

          Jeff

          Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 12:59 pm

          • Oh – so you now believe Eichmann survived as well – good for you!

            Comment by Talbot — March 23, 2016 @ 1:15 pm

          • Bonhams son sucks. He may be Gonzos son,but he have his daddy’s talent. I saw them in the 90’s when they thought Bonhams son would work okay. Ugh! There ain’t nobody out there that can keep up on the drums as long as Gonzo could. I remember watching “Song Remains the Same”(you remember. The movie about their concert at Madison Square Garden). Gonzo shredded his drum set . Funny thing about John,he didn’t have a big drum set,but the sound he got outta his drums was a mind f–k. The idiots like Tommy Lee that have the huge drum sets,ain’t worth a shit. Even a big a madman Keith Moon was on his drums (and other things),he’s still not in the same league as Gonzo was. I rember hearing about a week before his death,Gonzo was bummin big time. He told John Paul Jones in so many words,as a drummer he all washed up. John should’ve taken the bottle of scotch and bottle of pills from Gonzo and made him sober up. He must’ve been really drunk to be thinking that way . That’s kind of like them saying Paul Rogers from Bad Company was gonna take Freddie Mercurys spot in Queen. That’s not a bad idea. That was a f–ked up idea . Nobody can replace Freddie. He was the ultimate showman.

            Comment by Tim — March 23, 2016 @ 3:24 pm

            • Big Bad Company fan. Also a big Queen fan.

              Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 3:32 pm

            • Bonzo, not Gonzo

              Comment by Schlageter — March 24, 2016 @ 5:34 am

              • Yeah. I was thinking about Hunter Thompson.

                Comment by Tim — March 24, 2016 @ 8:53 am

    • Maybe he just saw the light, Jim.

      Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 10:32 am

      • Jeff…..lets reason on this……He would now be admitting he was wrong for many years, and it’s still not 6 million, not even close.
        So are you happy with 2 million? What figure makes you happy?
        Then show me how it all happened with actual mock ups of a homicidal death chamber with whatever silly thing they are going to use for the executions.
        So The Jews still hate him which shows how evil and vindictive they are. If Irving is right you would think they would congratulate him give him an award….LOL
        But NO they persecute and torture him even more. And this is a good thing? Please!

        JR

        Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 10:38 am

        • I actually didn’t have a chance to watch the video yet, Jim.

          I do know that David Cole and Irving now believe the Operation Reinhard Camps were death camps.

          Jeff

          Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 10:56 am

          • Mark Weber also thinks the Reinhard camps were death camps.
            Bottom line there were NO 6 million deaths simple as that. This revised revisionism is still considered Holocaust denial by the mainstream Holohuxsters

            JR

            Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 11:05 am

            • Wow, deniers who think the Germans actually killed Jews. What a concept.

              I guess they’ve suddenly realized that the idea of “transit camps” is ridiculous and impossible to prove.
              Jeff

              Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 11:15 am

              • The transit camps is not an issue with me as it is with you….but the mode of deaths is…..they can’t scientifically prove the people were killed the way they say they were. So they lie and people believe it. Jeff…..you do understand that if they could prove the mode of death happened the way they say it did they would win the case hands down but they can’t so they have to go with the lies and try to fool people into thinking that something happened a certain way when it didn’t.
                Jeff do you get what I’m saying here? The case would be closed if they could prove it…..
                There were NO 6 million deaths no matter what way you slice it. Two or three million is NOT 6 million, and the HoloHuxsters are bold face liars touting that 6 million figure……So why don’t the HoloHuxsters agree with Irving, and his buddies on this one?
                The reason being is they would have to admit they were wrong for all these years. So please explain how there were 3 million deaths and 4 million survivors? The gravy train has to be kept going and the money has to keep rolling in the anything that is not based on the 6 million lie can’t be accepted as true HoloHoax lore. So doesn’t that tell you something. David Irving in that video pretty much said that even with his new found revisionist death beliefs. So I still agree with him but not on the Reinehardt deaths, because when asked sometime back how did the people die in the Rhinehardt camps he said “I don’t know and don’t care” sounds like you.
                In order to prove his case you have to care and actually know what happened. This is not hard to understand, when it comes to the truth.
                Things either happened or they don’t, wishing they happened or thinking they happened a certain way with NO proof doesn’t make it true.

                JR

                Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 11:46 am

                • I was with David at Sobibor when the Israeli-Polish excavation crew. He vehemently challenged the film crew producer there about how the deaths occurred and where specifically on the premises these deaths were said to have taken place. (that shouldn’t be hard to prove: its about as big as a football field. the Jews who survived can’t seem to remember where exactly in a relatively small place their fellow inmates were (allegedly) gassed?

                  Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 12:22 pm

                • They (HoloHuxsters) can’t remember because it didn’t happen……finding tens of thousand of bodies in a small space shouldn’t be that hard to find. But invisible bodies that just went poof are…..LOL

                  JR

                  Comment by jrizoli — March 23, 2016 @ 12:31 pm

          • Again, Jeff, understanding the particulars of such an endeavor, just because they’ve BAILED on common sense, doesn’t meant it’s true. The logistics of accomplishing such a feat even boggles THEIR MINDS.

            Comment by Diane King — March 23, 2016 @ 11:47 am

            • “The logistics of accomplishing such a feat even boggles THEIR MINDS.”

              You mean, the feat of somehow transferring 1.5 million without a trace? No records of where they were sent?

              Diane, if you are going to tell me the Operation Reinhard Camps are transit camps you have to prove where they WENT.

              Jeff

              Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 11:52 am

              • perhaps the numbers of those transferred was less than thought? I mean, the numbers of overall deaths at Auschwitz (4 million to less than 1.1) and Majdanek (1.5 million to 59,000) have been “adjusted” too? or are we going off of “the Germans kept good records” argument?

                Comment by Schlageter — March 23, 2016 @ 12:27 pm

              • Away, Jeff. Honestly. Prior, during, post – shipped to various places, retreating from the Russians, flocking TO the Russians – living the wide life in Baltimore. Jim and others have offered evidence you continue to reject. I’ll not waste my time. I love Talbot’s method – scorn, derision, sarcasm, satirical, ridiculous STORY TELLING. I can’t wait for story #3. The jews were transited away period.

                Comment by Diane King — March 23, 2016 @ 12:44 pm

                • We are talking about a very specific time period, Diane. The truly mass deportations of Jews did not start until 1942 and continued until the Summer of 1944.

                  So, I ask again. Where did they go?

                  Jeff

                  Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 12:48 pm

                • I wrote about the Operation Reinhardt camps on this page of my scrapbookpages.com website: http://www.scrapbookpages.com/Poland/Treblinka/introduction.html

                  You wrote “Where did they go?” in reference to the Operation Reinhardt camps. They went East, and some of them eventually came back.

                  Comment by furtherglory — March 23, 2016 @ 1:00 pm

  8. I’m pretty critical of Goldhagen.
    I think his biases got the better of him.
    However, his book is a genuine example of revisionism, not the “revisionism” that deniers peddle.

    Jeff

    Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 9:41 am

  9. Look for this revisionist criticism to be expunged SO quickly that, if you go to the article on Wikipedia RIGHT NOW, you’ll note it gone (I expect).

    By the way, in THEORY the Wikipedia page is not Goldhagen’s – it is the property/creation of “all” Wikipedians, a group effectively dominated (like academia, the media, government, etc.) by supporters of Goldhagen’s point of view.

    Comment by Jett Rucker — March 23, 2016 @ 9:06 am

    • “a group effectively dominated (like academia, the media, government, etc.) by supporters of Goldhagen’s point of view.”

      If so, why is there universal criticism of Goldhagen’s book? Including Jewish historians?

      BTW, I’ve read Goldhagen’s Wikipedia page before.
      The “Criticism” that FG copied is the same I’ve read in the past.

      Comment by Jeff K. — March 23, 2016 @ 9:46 am


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